tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post7597456741578665267..comments2024-01-30T05:22:06.674-08:00Comments on A Majority of Two: The Little Odd-Shaped PendantJohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-79000904866098419952009-12-24T19:38:47.867-08:002009-12-24T19:38:47.867-08:00Why let the lunatic fringe set the rules? David D...Why let the lunatic fringe set the rules? David Duke's not in charge. Not even close.Miahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17881826389793941197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-82731222114901628922009-12-23T13:56:02.583-08:002009-12-23T13:56:02.583-08:00Bill and Mia, I know the swastika is an ancient sy...Bill and Mia, I know the swastika is an ancient symbol used by many cultures, including the Celtic culture and the Slavic culture, amongst many others. But unfortunately I believe it has become unredeemable.<br /><br />I know there is a movement to reclaim the swastika. However, Canadians died in World War II and in my opinion the swastika does not belong in any of the countries where this symbol and what it represented where a real threat. <br /><br />It is still used to this day to represent racism and the "white supremacy" of neo-nazis. "Google" the names George Lincoln Rockwell (deceased) or David Duke. They have a real following, and they use the swastika with the motto <em>"In Hoc Signo Vinces" (In this sign we conquer)</em><br /><br />It is unfortunate that this has happened to this symbol, but it has. In my opinion, it does not belong in pink gemstones on a little girl's necklace.Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-17924831234888570962009-12-22T20:42:22.944-08:002009-12-22T20:42:22.944-08:00Russell, apology accepted. You can take my word f...Russell, apology accepted. You can take my word for it that I understand why people are emotional about this particular symbol.<br /><br />Jo, we don't need any symbols to remember the murder of millions of innocent human beings. Those people will be remembered as long as we keep talking about them, honour them in prayer, visit some of the wonderful memorials throughout the world.<br /><br />The NSDAP had thousands of active members for a little over 20 years. Billions of people have used it as a religious symbol for thousands of years. Millions of Europeans used it before the Second World War. Even the American military and the Boy Scouts used it. You can't unring a bell so why unring billions of good bells in favour of one very bad bell?<br /><br />I don't often side with the majority but I'm going with the billions of decent people over the very few horrible people with this one.<br /><br />What did that city in Canada say, "to hell with them, we came up with the name first"?Miahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17881826389793941197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-16255595814955832722009-12-22T18:21:23.916-08:002009-12-22T18:21:23.916-08:00I don't think it's a question of 'defe...I don't think it's a question of 'defending' the swastika. It's more a question of reclaiming it from those who perverted it.<br /><br />Suppose some organisation took an existing symbol and used it to represent the antithesis of what it originally meant. Would the traditional meaning of the symbol be wiped out? Would everyone have to let the evil side define the symbol's meaning? Especially in a culture that allows people to wear the Japanese rising sun as a fashion statement and fly the Confederate flag?<br /><br />The Nazis don't get to define what a swastika represents because they lost. If we let them define the culture in any way, that gives them a power they don't deserve. <br /><br />They stole the symbol. Why not steal it back?<br />I can see why you wouldn't in European and American societies and that's fair enough, but why do we have to drag Asia along with us? They didn't do anything wrong.Billhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03412983524190021368noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-29182756879898629002009-12-22T08:50:20.163-08:002009-12-22T08:50:20.163-08:00Bill, in the south where the cross was representat...Bill, in the south where the cross was representative of the Ku Klux Klan, a lot of churches did ban the cross. You won't find the cross in many southern churches. But you cannot equate that with the atrocities that went on under the swastika. Why is everyone defending the God damned swastika? Pardonnez mon français.<br /><br />Mia, <em>"I just think it would be helpful if the Western world could see it in the same context as the rest of the world. I think that would be better for everybody."</em> I respectfully disagree with you. I'm glad the Western world will never forget. As George Santayana said, <em>"Those<br />who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."</em> There are too many people today who still use the swastika as a symbol of oppression.<br /><br />Russell, you should not apologize, and you should not have deleted your comments, and I feel very bad that you felt you had to do so. I apologize to you...! What this world is lacking is more people who have the courage of their convictions. Everyone is so damned <em>nice</em> to each other. I always agree with everything you say, and I agree with you that there is no defense for the swastika. It is an ugly symbol that represents something even uglier, and there is no defense for the swastika, especially in pink gemstones on a little girl's necklace...!Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-3750780293514068672009-12-22T07:21:04.433-08:002009-12-22T07:21:04.433-08:00Mia,
I apologize to you and to Jo and to anyone e...Mia,<br /><br />I apologize to you and to Jo and to anyone else who was offended by my remarks -- the ones you refer to that were deleted were posted by me.<br /><br />My father was in World War II. He was stationed in the South Pacific and the Japanese shot at him long after the war was over because they did not know the war was over and/or because they did not wish to surrender to the Allied Forces.<br /><br />My father had friends who were killed and wounded by the Nazis. It was a terrible time and such symbols as a swastika bring only sad and difficult memories to me and my family.<br /><br />But that is no excuse for me to critize you or others who find the symbol enlightening. You should be free to say what you wish and do what you wish without people like me standing in your way.<br /><br />It is sometimes best for people to keep their feelings to themselves and perhaps in my case that would be best.<br /><br />I wish you and yours only the best and, again, apologize to you for my insensitive and uncalled for remarks.Russellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11072219347283927398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-91842482703564713372009-12-21T19:19:36.905-08:002009-12-21T19:19:36.905-08:00But what I think we all really want to know is wha...But what I think we all really want to know is what gift did you find instead?Miahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17881826389793941197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-64839100126651055472009-12-21T19:16:53.442-08:002009-12-21T19:16:53.442-08:00But the KKK was in another part of the world so wh...But the KKK was in another part of the world so why should I care about it? I'm saying that to make a point. I guess I should mention that before anybody talks about sodomising people with objects.<br /><br />Land of Shrimp, you disagreed with me civilly. It's the comments that have since been deleted that I was referring to.<br /><br />My comment about recipes refers to an earlier discussion with Jo that she probably remembers.<br /><br />I don't have any problems whatsoever with people hating this symbol. It was used by purely evil people in the context you all see it. I just think it would be helpful if the Western world could see it in the same context as the rest of the world. I think that would be better for everybody.<br /><br />Some would say that's impossible but it's very possible and happens every day throughout Asia. Those billions of people aren't ignorant to what happened 80 years ago.Miahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17881826389793941197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-3139732585116593942009-12-21T18:06:49.618-08:002009-12-21T18:06:49.618-08:00Should Christians have found themselves a new symb...Should Christians have found themselves a new symbol after crosses became associated with the Ku Klux Klan?Billhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03412983524190021368noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-8244041380467428662009-12-20T20:40:41.696-08:002009-12-20T20:40:41.696-08:00Susan, yes, I think I will leave that particular o...Susan, yes, I think I will leave that particular on on the shelf. *sigh* Ghastly thing!Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-75973856272579311202009-12-20T20:29:49.668-08:002009-12-20T20:29:49.668-08:00Ewwww, how awful. I know, too, that the swastika ...Ewwww, how awful. I know, too, that the swastika is an ancient symbol which predates the Nazi German era by many centuries, but I am of the 20th Century and that is what it suggests to me.<br /><br />I hope you can find a sweet rose quartz bead necklace for Marigold without evil omens.heartinsanfranciscohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07535397382991383931noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-21371204711650388732009-12-20T17:05:34.156-08:002009-12-20T17:05:34.156-08:00Kenju, the swastika is so much more than just a sy...Kenju, the swastika is so much more than just a symbol. It is what is represented, and continues to represent to this day. The generation who lived -- and died -- under the swastika are now all passing away, or have long passed away. I have a good friend whose mother escaped from a concentration camp. She showed me her tattoo and told me stories of how her husband was killed there. We need them to remind us<br /> the swastika doesn't belong in pink gemstones on a little girl's necklace.<br /><br />I know in time the horror of the symbol will fade in future generations, but right now it is too fresh.Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-3474308392327303212009-12-20T16:11:20.056-08:002009-12-20T16:11:20.056-08:00All this reminds me of the time I went to a Unity ...All this reminds me of the time I went to a Unity Church funeral. There was an Egyptian symbol above the altar; I don't know the name of it, but it was the sun disk, with unfurled wings. A woman who accompanied me was most offended by it being there in a church, because as she said...."That is a Nazi symbol." I tried to remind her that before the Nazi's took it over - it was a revered and holy symbol of ancient Egypt. She was having none of that and wanted to leave. I just shook my head. Some people refuse to see the forest for the trees. <br /><br />I know there is a difference here, since the swastika became such a symbol of horrific violence, and the winged sun did not. I'm just saying......kenjuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07342414519714356343noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-41156994721910991742009-12-20T16:00:27.851-08:002009-12-20T16:00:27.851-08:00Alane, "It's not the symbols fault. Nor i...Alane, <em>"It's not the symbols fault. Nor is it the fault of the people who believe innocent, positive things in conjunction with that symbol...but in a contemporary setting, that symbol has been changed for the worse."</em> Bravo! For me, it seemed almost obscene to see that symbol done up in pink gemstones for a little girl to wear around her neck. It will take a long time -- if ever -- for that symbol to be redeemed, in my opinion at least. Unfortunately, it is still used today as a symbol of oppression of one group of people over another. All symbols have a strange history to them. I read the following on the Internet: <em>"Some conservative Christians object to the peace sign because they claim the centre image looks like an upside down broken cross, and as a result, mocks their religion. The peace sign has also been related to Satanism, as well as general immorality, since the peace sign was often worn by hippies in the 60's era of free love and drugs."</em> This does not equate to the swastika, however.<br /><br />I'm flattered that my post created a discussion in your home. That's wonderful...! That's what I like to hear.<br /><br />Paula, it made my skin crawl as well, and I was shocked to see it designed as a pretty, pink necklace.<br /><br />Pouty Lips, the cross is also used as decoration in what I consider inappropriate ways too. Ozzy Osbourne wore it on his shoes.Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-30125372317385214512009-12-20T15:39:07.860-08:002009-12-20T15:39:07.860-08:00Honestly, I don't like either swastikas or cro...Honestly, I don't like either swastikas or crosses. I found them both offensive. It makes little difference what they mean to others; I only care about what they mean to me, without apologies to anyone.Susan English Masonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05661766173970296173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-8134443039913596292009-12-20T15:36:38.960-08:002009-12-20T15:36:38.960-08:00It is most unfortunate that the swastika symbol el...It is most unfortunate that the swastika symbol elicits such a feeling of revulsion, as at one time it was considered good luck. I fully understood how you felt when you discovered the design of the necklace - the thought of it made my skin crawl.Paula Sladehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02923061193682673368noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-89348205787724361452009-12-20T14:59:36.540-08:002009-12-20T14:59:36.540-08:00Mia, you are, to the best of my knowledge (not hav...Mia, you are, to the best of my knowledge (not having seen the deleted comment) in a calm, and rational discussion. I don't agree with you, and have stated why, but that isn't the same as believing you to be wrong in any meaningful sense. <br /><br />I see where you are coming from, but hold a different viewpoint. I have reasons, you have reasons, we've both stated why. We may not be able to reach agreement, and that's cool. You have your convictions and I have mine. <br /><br />There may not be a middle ground here. <br /><br />But this: <br /><br />"<i>You could always post recipes. They're not often controversial.</i>"<br /><br />Please don't. Jo didn't do even one thing wrong in expressing her thoughts -- just as you didn't. <br /><br />Mutual respect involves both parties. If we want to be part of the calm, adult discussion? Then we (meaning all of us, you, me, the cat and the kitchen sink) have to hold ourselves to a standard of behavior. <br /><br />If someone errs, or strays, I let 'em...but I do my thing without slinging barbs. <br /><br />So that you will know, my husband and I sat around talking about precisely the point you raised, "What would it take for the symbol to be reclaimed after such a perversion?" for almost an hour, specifically because of the point you raised. <br /><br />I still don't agree with you, the Crusades, under which people were murdered and tortured were hundreds of years ago. The Holocaust was within the memory of people I personally know. <br /><br />The time for the symbol to be reclaimed would seem to be when we know better, and it is still the symbol of hate groups everywhere, sadly. <br /><br />It's not the symbols fault. Nor is it the fault of the people who believe innocent, positive things in conjunction with that symbol...but in a contemporary setting, that symbol has been changed for the worse. <br /><br />Just as in the Christian faith, there was a move away from icons, crosses, depictions of saints in the Protestant religions, because of misuse of symbols (among many, and other varied things).Land of shimphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15671954452597068904noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-21651571180461963512009-12-20T14:31:58.110-08:002009-12-20T14:31:58.110-08:00Sadly, I see the cross as an instrument of torture...Sadly, I see the cross as an instrument of torture and death - so I wear NO symbols of anything nor do I put any meaning into any of them (except maybe the smiley face).HAPPY IN NEVADAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17214341069801731994noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-34699516480226146942009-12-20T14:04:29.295-08:002009-12-20T14:04:29.295-08:00Kate, yes. Yes, yes, yes...! I don't understa...Kate, yes. Yes, yes, yes...! I don't understand why people apologize for that symbol. It's hideous.Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-35402808599377033392009-12-20T13:53:10.854-08:002009-12-20T13:53:10.854-08:00Do me a favor, Jo and don't ever change. Don&#...Do me a favor, Jo and don't ever change. Don't ever pander to what you think your followers might or might not like. And always express your opinions. It's what I enjoy about you.<br />I'd have dropped it too. I don't care what religion still worships this sign, but in this country it is the symbol of evil. End of story.Country Girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14432335393660130255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-2242022589014240562009-12-20T13:30:43.441-08:002009-12-20T13:30:43.441-08:00Arley, yes, I agree wholeheartedly. And more than...Arley, yes, I agree wholeheartedly. And more than that, I would challenge anyone -- <em><strong>ANYONE</strong></em> -- to buy a pink gemstone swastika and wear it. In western countries, it is a symbol of evil. I know it has a history of being a good luck symbol, but that was negated by Adolf Hitler and the Nazis. The swastika can never be redeemed, in my opinion.Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-42528466744932650812009-12-20T13:10:58.300-08:002009-12-20T13:10:58.300-08:00WOW! Jo, look what you started!!!!LOL....I have no...WOW! Jo, look what you started!!!!LOL....I have no idea what to say in this reguard. <br /><br />I'm Catholic and the crucifix means everything to me. I don't think anyone really took turning it upside down too seriously. In fact, I don't even know the story behind the "upside down crucifix" I'll look that up next, but my point is, people do remember and know what happened to all those killed under his rule. Unfortunately, he picked a symbol that did have good meaning to some, and turned it into a never ending sign of evil. In a perfect world, we could all get over the fact that Hitler used it as his "symbol" and return it to it's proper meaning. However this is far from a perfect world, and what's done is done. It WILL forever offend those who were hurt by its usage. It will forever be a sign of evil....in my opinion.<br /><br />Jo- How you feel is your personal prerogative. Don't let others steer you away from expressing your feelings on YOUR BLOG! If they don't like what you print, they can go elsewhere!!Scoobyloves2004https://www.blogger.com/profile/03282484197204359911noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-69158575848161707022009-12-20T12:46:54.290-08:002009-12-20T12:46:54.290-08:00Bonnie, yes, I suppose that could be true of any s...Bonnie, yes, I suppose that could be true of any symbol, but the swastika has a much more recent history -- at a time when folks should know better -- and continues to be a malevolent symbol.<br /><br />I just found it shocking on a little girl's pendant.Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-43609522044855737072009-12-20T12:29:53.610-08:002009-12-20T12:29:53.610-08:00I would be offended by discovering I had inadverte...I would be offended by discovering I had inadvertently purchased something with a swastika on it - even tho I know it is an ancient symbol and represents more than fascism. However, I agree with Mia, that people who are repelled by a swastika, if they want to apply the same logic, should be repelled by a cross too. It was the symbol of many atrocities in the middle ages.Bonnie Zieman, M.Ed.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00282469017360136275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1518800171649154035.post-81628999106203669782009-12-20T11:48:52.768-08:002009-12-20T11:48:52.768-08:00Oh, gosh...Oh, gosh...Johttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382221688268676914noreply@blogger.com